Galaxy's Edge Space Bar

[Chad32]

"Wouldn't it be nice if he didn't? Why would you want prisoners when you can have soldiers? You're wasting time trying to slowly infiltrate Earth just so you can spend resources keeping involuntary hosts in line when you could be making allies. You have personnel trying to hold people hostage when they could be protecting against the enemies you already have. So you have thousands of hosts. Whoopdie frikkin' do. How long did it take to get them? How long will it take to get enough hosts to be more than a drop in the bucket of what you need?"

"In war, you need resources as quickly and efficiently as possible. In your case the resource is hosts. Why do you think that what you're doing is the most efficient way of gaining them?"

Ike wasn't sure if he'd actually be able to reason with Haviss, but negotiation was probably better than just trying to rescue these involuntary Humans. Especially if Haviss or Elriss actually had the power to make changes in the Empire.

[Shenmue654]

Mar listened carefully to the exchange between Ike and the Imperial. Their conversation was interesting----what Ike was proposing was very similar to what his Precious' Peace Movement had been implying for some time. However, it was almost certain not to work with the Empire situated as it was. Oppression was built into the very code of the bureaucracy there, and he knew from---- Mar rubbed his forehead in confusion, a train of thought passing through his head and then stinging as it left. What had he known, exactly? Didn't matter.

"You speak very pragmatically for a Christian," states Mar, glancing at Ike with an odd look in his eyes. There was something not entirely right about this one, and he'd need time to determine exactly what. He did not like it. "It could work, were the Empire not as it is and the Yeerk population smaller. The Peace Movement thinks something along those lines, boy. It does not often get them very far. No matter the race, the easier choice is usually the one most wicked."

The reasons as to that last bit of information perplexed him. After all, he had very little power over Myitt's region.

[Chad32]

"Everyone has their own interpretation of what God wants from us. The only thing we really have is a book that was started thousands of years ago, and edited over time, and our interpretation of signs that may ot may not come from the Lord." Ike said.

"Haviss said every Yeerk has the opportunity to rise through the ranks, but is this only if they conform to a certain set of beliefs?" He asked this question more to Mar than to Haviss.

[Terenia]

Haviss' dark eyebrows raise. "Your god is nothing to me," he says flatly. "Why should a human book dictate how a Yeerk lives? I do not have the time to entertain fairy tales."

He glances at Mar. "The Peace Movement is full of a bunch of hippies who have gone so soft over their hosts they practically want to be human. At least the Rebellion shows initiative and is willing to put up a fight. The Empire could dismantle the Peace Movement and barely expend a single resource."

[Chad32]

"I'm not trying to convert you to my religion, though that would be nice. We're talking about your people here, so answer my question."

[Shenmue654]

Mar smiles slightly at Haviss. "Perhaps I am wrong about which is which, then. That does not surprise me---- being myself out of the conflict, all the names and ranks sound the same. The universe that I spend the most time in is one with no Yeerks, nor Andalites at all. As for calling tales of gods and men fairy tales...perhaps, in the details. Ways that human beings explain a baffling world. You'll find, however, that many of the actual encounters were real enough---- Higher aliens conferring with primitives on the borders between life and death."

"I do have a few investments in the conflict, however," says Mar with a nod of sorts as he raps his fingers on the Bar's surface. "Several of the Rebellion members and I have a bit of past history, as well as the War-Prince Ossanlin....and something...else that's slipped my mind. So I keep on with this coming back."

[Terenia]

Haviss scowls a little at Ike. "Those who care to go through the ridiculous hoops that lead to a Sub-Visser or a Visser rank do have to follow certain protocol, yes," he says. "And most of them do share a similar belief system regarding the war, to varying degrees. Some favor open war, others infiltration. But all of them, so far as I know, favor the expansion of the Yeerk Empire. Otherwise what is the point of attempting to be one of the leading forces in it?"

He blinks at Mar, the man's description of his own universe confusing him. He does pick up on part of his explanation as important though. "The Rebellion," he muses, "may be useful to me. Do you have means of contacting any of them?"

[Chad32]

"You don't have to make enemies of everyone you meet in order to expand your empire. You're just going to wind up running out of steam and collapsing because you don't have anything to fall back on when something goes wrong. Which it will. You would think a species that needs other species to thrive would be more altruistic, even if a Yeerk in someone's head has complete control. So about my other questions. How exactly do you think it's more efficient to infiltrate and kidnap people instead of making allies? Or using weapons and spending time and resources on prisons?"

[Terenia]

Haviss sighs. He is beginning to get a headache. Resigning himself to a potentially lengthy conversation he accepts the the free drink that the newcomer with the bird had bestowed upon all of the patrons and sits down at a table next to Ike. Not quite joining him, but remaining close enough to speak and allow Elriss and others to hear him.

"Diplomacy takes time," he says slowly, almost as if explaining to a child. "And, sometimes, just as many resources as war. A cage made out of a force field requires energy resources, yes, but little else. The weapons we have are plentiful and, due to our infiltration tactics on Earth, not even particularly necessary. There will be a good number of Yeerks who participate in the invasion of Earth while never lifting a weapon. Our methods on that planet are not particularly swift, no, but they are steady and require far fewer resources than open war or diplomacy. All we need is time, Kandrona, and human money. Which, it turns out, is easy to come by when you have the right people infested."

[Chad32]

"I'm not sure how diplomacy could take more time or resources. How long did it take you to get your thousand hosts, and why do you think it would be quicker and less risky than being open and asking for help? Sooner of later the Andalites are going to come, blow your little masquerade out of the water, and all you'll have to show for it is a few more hosts and billions of new enemies."

[Terenia]

"You certainly think highly of the Andalite military," Haviss says with a little snort of disdain. "They have already attempted to attack us in orbit over Earth. They failed miserably. The Andalites are an arrogant species and that very arrogance is why they will lose. They are stretched too thin to confront us, and they do not have the numbers to build a larger military."

He takes a sip of his beer, regarding Ike. Clearly not a politician, he decides. Though he isn't either. Not really. He just isn't an idiot. "As far as diplomacy is concerned, how exactly do you think your species would react to such an attempt? Humans treat anything different as a threat. Hell, humans treat people of a different skin color as a threat. For them to respond to us with anything other than loathing it would take ample time, and ample resources to assuage their paranoid trigger fingers. More than likely they would respond by declaring war themselves, and then where would we be?"

[Shenmue654]

"I suppose I do, by a fashion," says Mar, remembering his way of connecting Myitt's mind with his own. "However, you'd have to come into my neck of the woods for me to do that, and I highly doubt that you trust a complete stranger enough to allow for such jaunts. Granted you could literally come into me and find out, but in that case your host doesn't trust you."

[Chad32]

"I don't know much about the Andalite military, but I know it existed before your people had anything better than Gedds. You've had what, a few decades to work with stolen technology, while the Andalites have maybe had a century or more? Thin or not, there's something to be said about experience, and training that has passed through generations."

"Come on. Have you taken a cursory look at some of the creatures on the endangered species list? You know we sexualized vampires? Honestly the biggest hurdle to making an alliance is that you didn't try it first, and that can probably be gotten over by placing the blame on other people. Not everyone is a self serving racist or speciesist. You have six or seven billion people. You need maybe a few million to help you out? Some of which will be voluntary hosts despite how you currently treat them, and more if you treat them as equals. This should not be difficult."

[Aluminator (Kit)]

Elriss blinks and stares at Rathien for a moment, confused. "Sector Seven?" She laughs, "You're comparing us to that bunch of incompetents?" She smiles condescendingly at him, "Darlin', I know they're the supposed to be best the Andalites have to offer, but I hardly think they qualify as our equivalent. It's precisely Sector Seven's manipulativeness that's made them so..." she pauses, searching for a word, "...useful to us." She smirks, "And belief in one's cause isn't a weakness." She waves her empty glass at the bartender, who takes the hint and sets a second redin in front of her. "That's the biggest difference between us and them," she says, taking a sip, "We have no need to spread lies to our own people. So, what was it you wanted to discuss instead?"

She listens, sipping her drink, as the argument between Ike and Haviss grows more heated. This Mar... he's saying things that don't make sense. Things that send a shiver down Rose's spine. For the most part, she finds herself agreeing with Haviss... except for his apparent respect for the Yeerk Rebellion. Willing to actually fight for their cause, sure, but still murdering, deluded traitors, the lot of them.

Finally, she laughs and turns to Ike, "Our way keeps the humans in the dark. It avoids drawing Andalite attention. It keeps resource use low so that our fleet is free to engage the Andalites elsewhere. Although..." she grins. It's not a nice grin. "We have found it is best to give the humans a choice. Either fight us in their own minds or accept us voluntarily. Granted, not all of you are given that choice. Still, it's not a matter of whether your people retain their free will, it's just a matter of how much."

"You're giving your species too much credit if you think they'd accept it if we just came out in the open and asked for people to volunteer their bodies." She smiles at Ike, more warmly this time, "You're a pretty open-minded type, but most of you are stupid, panicky herd animals, and if you think someone could volunteer to host one of us and then not be discriminated against by the rest of your people, you've got another thing coming. You humans resist change, by force if necessary. You always have."

"It's simple, really. We need hosts. More hosts than would volunteer if we asked. We don't like violence.  It draws attention, and Yeerks and hosts can die in the process." She looks into his eyes and smirks, "And honey, if aliens suddenly appeared asking for people to volunteer their bodies, you can sure bet there'd be violence. Life is better for the hosts we do take, the species we do take. Someday, when we've taken all of the humans, they'll begin to realize that." She smirks and imitates his tone, "This should not be difficult."

She draws a breath as an analogy occurs to her, "Do you have children, Mr. Ike?" Without waiting for an answer, she continues, "Left to their own devices, children will eat glue and jump bikes and wander into traffic and wind up hurt or brain-damaged or crippled or dead. Humanity is just children. Left to your own devices, you will kill each other and decimate your planet's resources until you're too weak or sick or hurt to survive." She takes another swig of redin, swaying slightly. "But parents don't let children eat glue and break bones and walk in front of cars. You guide your children until they're old enough to know better. Even if the children kick and scream and cry, you'll do what's best for them."

Her nasty grin returns, "Humanity is just a child. The Empire is only helping you to grow up."

[Chad32]

"You seem insistent that the only people who would be willing to fight for you are people also willing to become hosts. That's just not true. Also if anyone is going to try to guide a galaxy's worth of species into enlightenment, it isn't going to be another mortal, flawed, species. As good as you think your kind is, it isn't any more perfect than anyone else. Only The One God is, and I assure you, wholeheartedly, that I have seen Him."

"I don't suppose you would need to lie to your kind if they would quickly starve to death if they didn't follow. The Andalites, I think, work under the assumption that if their people really saw what they were doing, they would quickly revolt. On the other hand, our Human government can do quite corrupt things without the population quickly turning on it."

"I just don't see your way of 'follow whether you want to or not' as very much more enlightened. Religion has tried that tactic too. It doesn't work very well."

"On a slightly different subject, why exactly is your control over a body so absolute? How do you go through life with someone yelling at you all the time, and unable to shut them up? Americans call pumping sound into a prison cell constantly over a long period of time a form of torture."