Did anyone dislike Jake's orders? (regarding Rachel)

[Tiana]

He had a tough enough time condemning one of his friends to death, adding one person wouldnt have made it any less of a suicide mission, it would have just been killing one more person. So he could have picked either rachel or marco, and the choice was obvious/

But why not Cassie or Tobias? I always thought Jake had a very protective attitude towards Cassie (understandable of course). I don't see why it's the obvious choice to pick his cousin to finish off his brother and be killed in the process when three other people were just as capable of doing the job.

[Duff]

Cassie was obviously not capable of doing it, she proved that

Tobias, i dno i should read it again whether could have, but even if he had been an option it still would have been rachel, it just is lol thats her character, she was always the one that could never live without the war, that wanted to go down in a glorious outnumbered fight, that really had no future past that day (that could be a whole topic in itself i know lol)

[Chad32]

I don't see why she wouldn't have a future past that day. Law, military, espionage, ect. She's not a one dimensional character.

[wotw2112]

Did Tobias have a morph capable of inflicting enough damage?  Hork-Bajir certainly wouldn't have gotten the job done (Rachel proved Grizzly> hork bajir over and over).

Cassie was definitely out - too unreliable in matters like that.

So I'll grant that Rachel was the reasonable choice if he couldn't do it himself.

However, my concerns are still:

1. Why not Jake himself?  I haven't heard a good reason for this yet (needs to lead is weak, needed for after the war negociations is meaningless as I doubt he was thinking about that at the time)

2. Why not come up with a better option rather than the solo mission?  They'd proven long ago that 2 or 3 animorphs was plenty to wreak havoc on countless numbers of Yeerks, morphing ability or not.

[Tiana]

I don't see why she wouldn't have a future past that day. Law, military, espionage, ect. She's not a one dimensional character.

^^She was really smart (didn't she win that outstanding scholars award?), good with fashion, etc. Her life didn't depend on the war, at least not the version of her that the ghostwriters wrote.

[Chad32]

They all got a polar bear morph in The Extreme, so Hork-Bajir isn't Tobias' only option for battle. It's just his preferred.

For some reason the ghostwriters wanted to make Rachel into a bloodthirsty warrior who was in love with fighting. That's not the true Rachel, though.

[wotw2112]

I don't see why she wouldn't have a future past that day. Law, military, espionage, ect. She's not a one dimensional character.

^^She was really smart (didn't she win that outstanding scholars award?), good with fashion, etc. Her life didn't depend on the war, at least not the version of her that the ghostwriters wrote.

I agree, I think Rachel would have handled the post-war far better than some of the other characters.

Great point about the polar bear though.  Forgot about that.

And I've never liked the idea of ghostwriters.

[Duff]

Like i said, that could be a whole topic on its own (and it has been at least a few times)

i just think she couldnt sit back and enjoy a peaceful life like the others, she would be out there looking for another war

the argument that he needed to lead is completely viable because as i have said the others didnt know the whole plan, only he did, and he had to keep it that way or the whole thing could have fallen apart



on a side note...thanks guys lol, i havent had a good heated animorphs debate in ages, and im having a blast haha

...screw you guys!

[wotw2112]

on a side note...thanks guys lol, i havent had a good heated animorphs debate in ages, and im having a blast haha

...screw you guys!

Lol 

But it's not unheard of for a plan to be orchestrated perfectly without the direct attention of the plan-maker (for lack of a more apt word).  As long as everyone knew what they were supposed to do (which they did), his absence shouldn't be a problem.  Most of the others seem at least fairly competent and capable.

[Tiana]

the argument that he needed to lead is completely viable because as i have said the others didnt know the whole plan, only he did, and he had to keep it that way or the whole thing could have fallen apart

But the Animorphs are supposed to be a team. Even when Jake was the leader, the rest knew what was going on and contributed to w/e process.

in this last battle, Jake really behaved like a dictator. Why couldn't he tell others the plan?

[Duff]

there were still calls that had to be made, not really choices persay, but calls that needed to be made at a specific times based on the overall plan

and even without that, you are assuming that everything goes perfectly to plan, which it pretty much did, but jake cant assume that, he has to assume that there are going to be big decisions that need to be made and that he needs to be there for them

he couldnt tell them because half of them would never have went along with it, it was horrifying in retrospect lol

[filmstu2005]

Exactly. They knew what was at stake and they werent gonna f*** it up, so Jake's presence was not essential.

Maybe it is poetic that Jake would face his own brother, but i' think it wouldve been a better read for the last book. Instead of having Rachel go when that plan alone wasn't entirely rational.

And Rachel would have lived fine past the war. She was only 16! And KA tried to make us think Rachel wouldnt be able to function without a war. Where was the faith? Rachel was smart. If I recall, the Rachel who narrated right before her death in the last book was looking forward to a life past the war. She even thought it was unfair to have made it that far only to lose it all. Sounds like she was eager to live.

[wotw2112]

there were still calls that had to be made, not really choices persay, but calls that needed to be made at a specific times based on the overall plan

and even without that, you are assuming that everything goes perfectly to plan, which it pretty much did, but jake cant assume that, he has to assume that there are going to be big decisions that need to be made and that he needs to be there for them

he couldnt tell them because half of them would never have went along with it, it was horrifying in retrospect lol

Perhaps if he had included them all they could have come up with a better plan.  He wasn't really thinking clearly.  And how often do plans ever go off without a hitch?  If something went wrong it wouldn't have mattered if he was there or not.

[Duff]

of course it would have, how many times had something gone wrong and jake been forced to make a tough field decision that saved their butts, oodles of times

throw it back to the cowards argument, this was his plan, and it was not a nice plan, it was screwing over alot of people(doubleday, taxxons, chee sorta, auxiliaries) and jake needed to own up to all of that, he made alot of promises and even if he didnt think he was going to keep them, heading out to his death with all of that unfinished would be cowardly, him opting out of his obligations just for some grudge with his brothers yeerk is cowardly

just another perspective on it

[filmstu2005]

oodles?