The Chee's Non-violence programming

[DinosaurNothlit]

There are a few things I've often wondered about Erek's supposed 'non-violence' programming.

First off, would everyone agree that, by definition, Erek is prevented from committing acts that would harm another being, correct?  By extension, he is preventing from committing acts that would only later cause someone to come to harm.  Like, he could not hand someone else a gun and then tell them that their girlfriend was cheating on them, just as a random theoretical example.

Why is it, then, that he was even able to re-write his own programming in book 10, when, by doing so, he would then be able to cause others to come to harm?  Wouldn't his own programming have stopped him from re-writing his programming, since he knew full well that he would then kill a bunch of people?

And for that matter, what was the deal with what he did in book 32?  He admits that the procedure for re-uniting the two Rachels could kill both of them, and yet he is able to do it anyway!  Shouldn't his programming have stopped him?

[Chad32]

The thing in 32 was blatant KASU. There's no way he's be able to do something that would cause such intense pain. He basiclly electrocuted both Rachels.

I don't know about the reprogramming thing. Maybe there's some exception that would allow him to reprogram himself, even though his intent for reprograming was to hurt the Yeerks.

[MoppingBear]

here is my opinion on the matter.  the chee are inteligent, and the "non-violence" programming probably takes that into account.  therefore, eric is unable to do anything that he perceives as "doing harm"  in the case of rachel, he perceived it as helping her, and was able to do it.  in the case of rewriting his programming, it is not directly leading to someone's harm, just allowing him to do so at a later time.  it is possible that a large chunk of his code was "decompiled" when he was editing it, and wasn't active.

the thing that bothered me most about that book was how they just chucked the crystal into the ocean.  i mean, i can understand how he was traumatized by what he did, but in all his android wisdom, he could not conceive of a situation in which he might need to defend himself?  that he might learn to control himself and not kill any more than the animorphs do?  that someone might find the damn crystal again?  they should have at least kept it hidden somewhere...

[Chad32]

Yeha, that too. How does throwing it in the ocean make it any less likely for the Yeerks to find it than how they did before? Though it's not mentioned how they did it before.

I would have kept it. I would have also gotten him to use it again at the end, to keep him from doing something stupid.

[Darth Revan]

Yeah, I thought that was too unrealistic, but then again, they are a bunch of 13 year olds. When you're 13, the ocean seems a pretty good place to get rid of something.

[DinosaurNothlit]

Yeah, I had a hunch the thing in book 32 was a KASU, but I'd never seen it addressed as one.  I always hate to simply admit that something was a KASU, though.

here is my opinion on the matter.  the chee are inteligent, and the "non-violence" programming probably takes that into account.  therefore, eric is unable to do anything that he perceives as "doing harm"  in the case of rachel, he perceived it as helping her, and was able to do it.  in the case of rewriting his programming, it is not directly leading to someone's harm, just allowing him to do so at a later time.  it is possible that a large chunk of his code was "decompiled" when he was editing it, and wasn't active.

the thing that bothered me most about that book was how they just chucked the crystal into the ocean.  i mean, i can understand how he was traumatized by what he did, but in all his android wisdom, he could not conceive of a situation in which he might need to defend himself?  that he might learn to control himself and not kill any more than the animorphs do?  that someone might find the damn crystal again?  they should have at least kept it hidden somewhere...

You can't really discount it as him being able to simply decide for himself that he's doing more help than harm.  After all, if the Chee had fought in the war, they could have ended it much sooner, resulting in less loss of life overall.  Yet the Chee still were not able to participate in the fighting, because their programming forbid it.  And saying that it isn't directly leading to harm doesn't work either, because, as you said in your own post, the Chee are intelligent, so it wouldn't have mattered how the first thing led to the second; they still would have seen the connection for themselves, and thus been unable to perform the first action.

Your second point is a very good one.  Even putting aside all the advantages for the Chee, the crystal could still have been useful for programming good ol' earth technology.  Remember how long it took Ax to create a permanent way to contact the Andalite fleet?  They could have used the crystal to help with that.  They even said that it works with earth computers, because that's what the Yeerks intended to use it for.  I think they justified getting rid of it with the "we can't let it fall into the wrong hands" excuse, but that was weak.  They could have kept it from the Yeerks, even if they had kept it.

[MoppingBear]

but its a lot less direct.  eric also feeds the animorphs information that he knows will lead to them attacking the yeerk pool and killing people.

[Darth Revan]

Yes, but he's not hurting them. The Chee themselves can't hurt others, what other species do is their perogative.

[DinosaurNothlit]

but its a lot less direct.  eric also feeds the animorphs information that he knows will lead to them attacking the yeerk pool and killing people.

Hmm, that's a good point, and it flies right in the face of what I was saying earlier about Erek not being able to do things that could cause people to come to harm.  I will have to think about this one.

I guess it does make sense that he could do some things that very indirectly lead to deaths.  To quote book 7: a butterfly flapping its wings in China can cause a hurricane in the States.  Meaning that, no matter what you do, your actions will have consequences that you don't forsee.  Or even that you do forsee, since the Chee are so intelligent that they might have a better shot at predicting stuff like that than we do.  If they could never ever do anything that would cause harm to someone somewhere, they could never do anything.