Author Topic: New theory on Crayak's origins  (Read 3855 times)

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Offline Darth Zakryn

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New theory on Crayak's origins
« on: March 23, 2011, 01:02:38 PM »
I was just rereading New Jedi Order The Unifying Force and it just came to me as I was reading it: What if Crayak (before he "merged" with space-time like Ellimist did) was originally a living planet? If so, does that mean he has a creator? Zonama Sekot, the living planet in TUF, is the seed of Yuuzhan'tar, the living planet that either created or played host to the Yuuzhan Vong. Could something like that be the case here?

Offline RAFrukh

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2011, 01:28:59 PM »
I don't know about the creator part, but the living planet seemed pretty obvious.
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Offline Zero_Messiah

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2011, 04:20:20 PM »
Biologically, an entire sentient planet is pretty unfeasible.

Suspension of disbelief aside, I don't think a 'higher power' would cast a planet out of its system; it would have been destroyed easily.

Offline RAFrukh

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2011, 10:07:04 AM »
^Good point.

But living planets are what sci-fi is made of!! XD.
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Offline Darth Zakryn

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2011, 10:25:16 PM »

Yeah. That higher power could be anything. Maybe even Crayak's creator, seeing how out of control its creation had become.

Offline DinosaurNothlit

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2011, 10:49:40 PM »
You know, the whole "higher power" thing never really made sense to me.  When Crayak was kicked out of his galaxy or whatever, he was still a more-or-less mortal (or at least physical) creature.  That's how he was when the Ellimist met him, right?  Granted he had his own planet (was his own planet?), but at that point he was not yet a nearly-omnipotent being that existed beyond the fabric of space-time.  Either the force that kicked him out was made up of nearly-omnipotent beings that existed beyond the fabric of space-time (in which case, why didn't Crayak ever try to copy their example?) or Crayak has now become more powerful than the "higher powers" that originally kicked him out.  Food for thought.

As far as the living planet issue goes, I don't think so.  Not that I think it's implausible (Father was pretty much a living planet), but rather because of how he's described when he decides to take physical form.  A melding of biological and mechanical parts with a giant red eye.  It seems to me that Crayak probably started off as a biological creature that incorporated machines into his own structure to make himself more powerful, basically turning into a living spaceship like the Ellimist did (probably for different reasons, though).  And the 'planetoid' that is described in the Ellimist chronicles sounds more like an extension of this body/ship, rather than his original form.  Sorta like the Death Star, I guess.

Offline nocoolnametim

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2011, 09:37:19 AM »
What about a living asteroid? At least that would fit nicely in with the rest of the animorphs universe.

Post Merged: March 25, 2011, 10:14:24 AM

Yeah. That higher power could be anything. Maybe even Crayak's creator, seeing how out of control its creation had become.
I imagine the higher power simply being an allusion to God as it never got mentioned again. Plus the whole thing is inconsistent with The Ellimist wondering if there were powers even greater than himself and the Crayak in the Universe.
I really wish they had addressed who or what that greater power was though that banished the Crayak. Could have been a great plot point.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2011, 10:14:24 AM by nocoolnametim »

Offline anijen21

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2011, 11:52:23 AM »
Either the force that kicked him out was made up of nearly-omnipotent beings that existed beyond the fabric of space-time (in which case, why didn't Crayak ever try to copy their example?) or Crayak has now become more powerful than the "higher powers" that originally kicked him out.  Food for thought.

I vote for the second example. In fact, I'd wager a bet that Crayak either was too wrapped up in his squabble to end all squabbles with the Ellimist, or took care of that niggling unresolved thread off screen.

OR MAYBE HE JUST FORGAVE AND FORGOT LOL :'(
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Offline nocoolnametim

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2011, 12:20:26 PM »
Either the force that kicked him out was made up of nearly-omnipotent beings that existed beyond the fabric of space-time (in which case, why didn't Crayak ever try to copy their example?) or Crayak has now become more powerful than the "higher powers" that originally kicked him out.  Food for thought.

I vote for the second example. In fact, I'd wager a bet that Crayak either was too wrapped up in his squabble to end all squabbles with the Ellimist, or took care of that niggling unresolved thread off screen.

OR MAYBE HE JUST FORGAVE AND FORGOT LOL :'(
Maybe when the Ellimist mentioned it in Book 26 the Crayak was like, "Oh Yeah! Excuse me a moment I'm gonna go take care of that right now." And then when he got back the Animorphs had defeated the Howlers and he went all Darth Vader and was all like, "NNNNOOOOOOOO!!!!"

Offline Morilore

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2011, 01:10:23 PM »
The end of the Ellimist Chronicles definitely gives the impression that E+C are the only two beings at that level in the universe.  The Ellimist said that if they fought as they were now, they would destroy the universe; if some power existed that was greater than they were at that point, you would think that it would go "lol no" and prevent Crayak from ever becoming that dangerous.

Offline nocoolnametim

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2011, 01:37:29 PM »
The end of the Ellimist Chronicles definitely gives the impression that E+C are the only two beings at that level in the universe.  The Ellimist said that if they fought as they were now, they would destroy the universe; if some power existed that was greater than they were at that point, you would think that it would go "lol no" and prevent Crayak from ever becoming that dangerous.
possibly, but it wouldn't likely speak up and simply say that to them. It would probably continue to remain anonymous until they made the decision to do so. I do wonder though if the universe collapsed would they actually die? My guess is even they can't say for sure.

Offline Morilore

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2011, 06:14:08 PM »
Then again, in 26 the Ellimist said that Crayak's ultimate ambition was to return home and "destroy the one power greater than himself," implying that it's still above them both (lol Christianity allegory).  I mean KA clearly hadn't worked out the entire backstory at that point so maybe in the rerelease this story will be changed but whatever.

Offline Dogman15

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2011, 11:44:56 PM »
Then again, in 26 the Ellimist said that Crayak's ultimate ambition was to return home and "destroy the one power greater than himself," implying that it's still above them both (lol Christianity allegory).  I mean KA clearly hadn't worked out the entire backstory at that point so maybe in the rerelease this story will be changed but whatever.
Being a Christian myself, I think I like that theory. The Ellimist and Crayak always made it difficult to see how Christianity could fit into the Animorphs universe (we know they have churches and stuff and Earth is - for all intents and purposes - still the same Earth with a slightly different history when it comes to aliens). I could talk more about how Christianity could fit into Animorphs, but this isn't the place. Good idea Morilore!

Offline Morilore

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2011, 01:35:22 AM »
Quote
Being a Christian myself, I think I like that theory. The Ellimist and Crayak always made it difficult to see how Christianity could fit into the Animorphs universe (we know they have churches and stuff and Earth is - for all intents and purposes - still the same Earth with a slightly different history when it comes to aliens). I could talk more about how Christianity could fit into Animorphs, but this isn't the place. Good idea Morilore!
Um.  "Allegory" means the creature isn't actually, literally God.  It just means that it's meant to be evocative of Christianity; specifically the part where the devil is cast out of paradise.
You know how KAA likes Tolkien and talks about why she thinks LOTR has a better end than Star Wars?  Tolkien had a couple of things to say about this discussion: one, he hated allegory in general, so when people said "Sauron = Hitler" he was like "no."  Two: he didn't think a fantasy story should explicitly include the Christian religion.  He clearly wanted his fictional universe to be compatible with his devout Catholicism, but he didn't want to put his mythology and doctrine into the story explicitly, and he said that for some reason he couldn't quite explain, it didn't seem right.

P.S. There is absolutely nothing about the Ellimist and Crayak that is incompatible with Christianity even if you don't explicitly connect them to God.  They are just extremely powerful finite creatures.  Tolkien's mythology has creatures presented as demigods but his mythology is still compatible with Christianity because those creatures are created and finite and not meant to be worshipped.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2011, 01:37:58 AM by Morilore »

Offline Dogman15

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Re: New theory on Crayak's origins
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2011, 02:03:47 AM »
Huh. Given me something to think about, you have. Thanks!  :)