Ultimate Animorphs

[Chad32]

I always liked the idea that the ellemist was helping them survive. I know some people don't like the idea, and want to limit him, or get rid of him, but it's more of a reason for plot armor than some other shows give.

[TobiasMasonPark]

I'd drop...the Iskoort. I might drop the Ellimist and Crayak altogether, honestly.

 

     I liked the Iskoort though. The Departure set up the Yeerks as not completely evil with the Yeerk Peace Movement, and the Attack, at least for me, gave the Yeerks hope of changing their ways.

     I liked having the Ellimist and Crayak in the series. Yea, I can see why one would think they were a huge deus ex machina, but I liked how it provided the series with a good old fate vs freewill debate. They also put the series into perspective-- the the war was just ONE battle between the Ellimist and Crayak. Once the Yeerk Empire falls, they'll move on to something else.

     Also, assuming we're keeping Tobias as a nothlit, how would he regain his morphing powers without the Ellimist? And, if we limit the Ellimist's role in the series, then--at least to me-- using him to give Tobias the morphing power again would be more of a cheesy plot device than in the original run.

     I don't know. I personally don't think they were used too often. The Stranger, the Attack, the Drode in the Exposed, the Return, and the Andalite Chronicles. The Ellimist Chronicles, naturally, explained his origins, so that was needed. And, of course, the Ellimist, Crayak and the Drode have their limitations. [/quote]

Now there's an interesting thought. I like this idea. It would add depth to the world, and provide a way to make the invasion seem bigger than just the Yeerks hiding out in the Animorphs' hometown.

     Agreed.

6) Character deaths.  A major recurring character should die sometime midway through the series.

Yeah, for a series that occasionally tried to be so mature and serious, the fact that everyone always came back unscathed kind of gave it the feel of a Saturday morning cartoon. There needs to be some reason for us to sense that the Animorphs are actually in danger, and killing off a character occasionally would keep that very real.[/quote]

     I shall paraphrase Alloran by saying that not all heroes ever really come home. By that I mean that, while the Animorphs came back "unscathed", as you put it, they were mentally shaken. Morphing takes away a lot of the wounds, and the Animorphs were VERY lucky. But that happens with plenty of books, though. Harry Potter, for example, only started killing people off after Prisoner of Azkaban, but you didn't need a whole bunch of people dying to show how high the stakes were.

     I don't know. I guess I could accept having one of them die mid-series. But I wouldn't want it to happen too often.

     As for expanding their numbers, I'm not sure. It would have to be handled well. If we're keeping David as the new guy, then the experience would make them wary about who they let in. If he's one of the originals, they'd probably add more.
     

[Snakie]

Here is an idea that I've never really thought about.  I thought about making this its own thread but it seems to fit nicely here.

Anyone think the original group dynamics (excluding my David as an original idea for a moment) should be different? In other words, any changes to the group structure (modifying or replacing primary characters) that might make for more interesting character interactions?

In the original series you have:

1) The fearless leader with personal reasons for being in the war.
2) The weak and emotionally unstable but gentle soul who ends up shouldering the biggest burden of all.
3) The moralizer/moral compass of the group.
4) The overzealous Yeerk killer.
5) The skeptical strategist with a personal beef with the enemy.
6) The alien with a legacy to uphold.

Who do you replace or change?  If you could add a 7th member what characteristics would they have?  How would that make the series more interesting?

To be clear, I really liked the original mix of characters that we have.  I just thought this was an interesting line of discussion.

[TobiasMasonPark]

     It's an interesting topic for discussion. Kudos.

     I'd keep the Animorphs in their proper roles, but either emphasize or down play some of the stuff mentioned in the earlier books. I can't help but think of Melissa and David as "Potentials", like in Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Maybe have Melissa integrated into the group somehow--I mean, why keep the girl in the dark, probably facing depression from the way Rachel and her parents treat her, when you have a means of having her fight? Maybe instead of Rachel or one of the main Animorphs, Melissa could be the casualty?

     This, of course, has drawbacks: an Animorph living with one controller was bad; imagine living with two--one of whom is a very high ranking Yeerk. And surely Melissa's parents would be suspicious of the nature of their daughter's death.

     Also: maybe have the group come to the decision that the Yeerks wouldn't want the disabled. This would help with the numbers thing, and keep the Yeerks assured that the group is composed of Andalites. At least...in theory.

[Snakie]

I was actually thinking the series might also benefit from having a kid at the construction site who one or more of the Animorphs had a NEGATIVE relationship with.

One thing the series really lacked (and a partial reason why I proposed the David as an original idea earlier) is genuine friction between the characters early on.  You've basically got two pairs of best friends linked together by family and love interest, and an "outsider" who is emotionally unstable but ultimately inoffensive to the rest of the group.  The most we ever get in terms of early conflict is some snide remarks from Marco directed at Tobias early in the books. 

It would be nice if there was some internal conflict early that needs to be dealt with, and I suppose that doesn't NECESSARILY have to come from a character who ends up betraying them.

Thoughts?

[Aluminator (Kit)]

I liked the Iskoort though. The Departure set up the Yeerks as not completely evil with the Yeerk Peace Movement, and the Attack, at least for me, gave the Yeerks hope of changing their ways.

I agree with you there, but the Iskoort may have been more effective if they were... like, ever mentioned again.

     I liked having the Ellimist and Crayak in the series. Yea, I can see why one would think they were a huge deus ex machina, but I liked how it provided the series with a good old fate vs freewill debate. They also put the series into perspective-- the the war was just ONE battle between the Ellimist and Crayak. Once the Yeerk Empire falls, they'll move on to something else.

     Also, assuming we're keeping Tobias as a nothlit, how would he regain his morphing powers without the Ellimist? And, if we limit the Ellimist's role in the series, then--at least to me-- using him to give Tobias the morphing power again would be more of a cheesy plot device than in the original run.

     I don't know. I personally don't think they were used too often. The Stranger, the Attack, the Drode in the Exposed, the Return, and the Andalite Chronicles. The Ellimist Chronicles, naturally, explained his origins, so that was needed. And, of course, the Ellimist, Crayak and the Drode have their limitations

You raise some good points for keeping the Ellimist in, and the whole Ellimist concept is something that makes Animorphs... Animorphs. I'd just want to cut out some of the... like, cheapness they bring with them on occasion.

As for expanding their numbers, I'm not sure. It would have to be handled well. If we're keeping David as the new guy, then the experience would make them wary about who they let in. If he's one of the originals, they'd probably add more.

That's a good point. Maybe David shouldn't be an original, simply because the fact that he caused them so many issues as a new recruit is a lot of the reason they didn't recruit more people in the original series.

What if the Animorphs recruited him earlier, and then we got the chance to know him, and then he betrays them later on? Sort of split the difference between his being a new recruit and his being an original?

Here is an idea that I've never really thought about.  I thought about making this its own thread but it seems to fit nicely here.

Anyone think the original group dynamics (excluding my David as an original idea for a moment) should be different? In other words, any changes to the group structure (modifying or replacing primary characters) that might make for more interesting character interactions?

In the original series you have:

1) The fearless leader with personal reasons for being in the war.
2) The weak and emotionally unstable but gentle soul who ends up shouldering the biggest burden of all.
3) The moralizer/moral compass of the group.
4) The overzealous Yeerk killer.
5) The skeptical strategist with a personal beef with the enemy.
6) The alien with a legacy to uphold.

Who do you replace or change?  If you could add a 7th member what characteristics would they have?  How would that make the series more interesting?

To be clear, I really liked the original mix of characters that we have.  I just thought this was an interesting line of discussion.

I like seeing them listed like this. I don't think I'd change that group, much, if at all. It really is a very strong, respectably broad mix.

I was actually thinking the series might also benefit from having a kid at the construction site who one or more of the Animorphs had a NEGATIVE relationship with.

One thing the series really lacked (and a partial reason why I proposed the David as an original idea earlier) is genuine friction between the characters early on.  You've basically got two pairs of best friends linked together by family and love interest, and an "outsider" who is emotionally unstable but ultimately inoffensive to the rest of the group.  The most we ever get in terms of early conflict is some snide remarks from Marco directed at Tobias early in the books. 

It would be nice if there was some internal conflict early that needs to be dealt with, and I suppose that doesn't NECESSARILY have to come from a character who ends up betraying them.

Thoughts?

I am definitely with you. If we were doing that, we'd want to change the initial group relationships. Rachel and Jake can be cousins, but they don't have to be cousins who get along. I could see Rachel and Marco just, like, hating each other from school. We could play up the Marco bagging on Tobias thing. Really, a number of directions we could take that, and it would be interesting to watch them grow and learn to rely on each other, getting all "brothers in arms" or whatever. I think this particular thread would be more interesting if the characters who don't get along are actually not whoever ends up betraying them- though a little occasional conflict with David couldn't hurt.

A lot of my problems with the team have to do less with archetypes than they do with the characters' development. Cassie decides, like, a dozen times, that they have to fight, for the good of humanity and the good of the Earth. She decides it definitively and repeatedly, and each time the lesson remains unlearned, to be rehashed in a later book. Same deal with Ax- if you take a look, almost every Ax storyline has to do with him questioning his loyalty to the Animorphs, and then deciding at the end that he's with them until the end. Also, he's on Earth for three years but never learns to not play with mouth-sounds, which I know is a great joke, but it makes him seem like kind of an idiot after a while. Ax can have other jokes. And the rest of the characters have their own issues, too, with inconsistent development, especially with the ghostwriters. I'd just want all of that to be more consistent and believable.