Richard's Animorphs Forum
Animorphs Section => Animorphs Forum Classic => Topic started by: Darth Zakryn on November 16, 2011, 04:12:53 PM
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I was just rereading Megamorphs 2 and I realized that the Animorphs' perception of evolution is all screwed up. Tobias ate a small rodent and said that that rodent might have been the great ancestor of humanity. What? What? How can a RODENT be an ancestor of a PRIMATE? Evolution is the definition of adapting to your surrounding environment through changes on the genetic level, but turning from a rodent into a primate just a downright mutation, and mutation is NOT the same thing as evolution. One species cannot randomly become another. Well, this is my belief.
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But isn't evolution created from mutation? So maybe that rat's baby rats were mutant, and that kept on going and going and going ad created primates. That what I thought at least.
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To be fair, Tobias doesn't necessarily have to have a perfect understanding of evolution. I know I didn't at 14, which is pretty much the oldest he could be in MM2. And when I read it the first time, it sort of read like "We don't know what we're screwing up just by being here"--the usual time travel dilemma.
That being said, there's a lot wrong with that book, even allowing that the Animorophs aren't exactly experts on things.
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Well, first of all, the term that Tobias used in the book was 'rat', not 'rodent.' Which actually only makes it all the more incorrect, since what Tobias was eating most likely couldn't have even been an actual rodent, let alone anything remotely related to rats. The term 'rodent' refers to a specific group of placental mammals that most likely didn't even exist in North America until around 40 million years ago (http://io9.com/5850577/the-ancestor-of-all-american-rodents-really-came-from-africa), which would have been well after the extinction of the dinosaurs.
It was certainly a rat-like creature, though. Practically all mammals during that time period were small, short-legged, low-slung critters that you would probably call a 'rodent' if you saw one. The ancestors of primates, indeed, were thought to have that basal rodent-esque body shape.
In summary, the thing that Tobias got wrong was his use of the word 'rat.'
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A lot of people really don't understand evolution. Take religious people for example. They think people just sprang up out of rocks or something, when that's actually what Christians believe. not evolutionists. I don't blame Tobias or even KAA for not really understanding evolution or what to call species. Certainly what Tobias saw wasn't a rat.
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First, to be fair to Tobias he said "That could have been the rat that will pass on the genetic material that someday grows a smarter rat. And fifty million years from now, maybe that's the DNA, the stuff that's needed to push the earliest primate over the top. I may have wiped out the human race"
That's not saying rodents suddenly turn into primates
Second, you yourself are blurring evolution and natural selection.
Evolution doesn't have to be adaptive: Evolution is change in gene frequency. Doesn't exclusively mean descendants are better suited to a setting (in fact if one set of genes is becoming better adapted and through that more frequent, than another set of genes must be becoming less frequent. Both are still evolving).
Natural selection promotes adaptation, but it is just one way in which populations evolve.
And finally yes, evolution does not work that way: and the rodents do not in any case give rise to the primates: that connection's a long way back (http://mbe.oxfordjournals.org/content/27/10/2352/F2.small.gif)
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Ive tried to erase all memory of that book.
I'm not a fan of the Sario Rip plot device. Basically just a way of saying that a book never happened, and it was invoked twice, in part to erase morphs.
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RYTX: Thanks for correcting me on that. Like I said, I'm not a scientist, and evolution does seem to come under a lot of heavy debate, so naturally I don't know ALL about it.
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no worries.
It's the duty of scholars to know.
It's the obligation of all to teach.
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Re the 'that's what Christians believe', it depends on if it's an old earth view or young earth. Old earth still accepts the millions of years view. On a side note, it's often mistaken is that young earthers completely reject evolution, but they don't...they still accept natural selection and adaptation, just not molecules-to-man. (but I do see where the comment came from, the 'formed from dust' aspect.) But that's a topic for another area, so that's all I'll say.
I liked the dinosaur one myself, just kinda wished they'd been able to bring the morphs back home lol
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That was a total bomb-out, in my opinion. Why didn't K.A. keep them? I know the Status Quo Is God, but this is one of those instances where it SHOULDN'T be. Think about it: The Animorphs could TOTALLY own EVERY SINGLE Hork-Bajir and Taxxon, and then get into a big, rocking battle with Visser Three's most powerful morph-of-the-day. Ohhhh yeah. I think my head might literally explode from the sheer awesomeness of such a scenario. What a letdown. :'(
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I think you just answered your own question in the same paragraph.
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Sorry, I should have been clearer. The point I am trying to make is acquiring dinosaur morphs would have been the turning point in the war.
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I don't think it'd be practical.
Because even though the entire Yeerk Empire, using their high tech beam weapons, proved time and again to be incapable of hitting tigers, wolves, bears, birds, even people with lethal effect, I have to figure someone, at least one, would be able to hit the broad side of a Tyrannosaurus should it turn up in a fight.
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That, and there's only so many places where having a T-Rex morph in battle would work, practically speaking. It'd be kind of useless for an indoor fight, and outside... uh... well, nothing ruins the whole "secret war" thing faster than the sudden appearance of extinct animals. Then you've got the potential dangers of all-out war.
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While I agree that, for the sheer science of the matter that they should have kept the DNA of the dinosaurs, I'm not entirely convinced that dinosaur morphs would be so useful as to win the war. (Then again, it seems like all Yeerks have absolutely no idea how to aim a gun...but I digress...)
Using such a large and unusual morph would cause a lot of problems.
-It would be nearly impossible to keep the war under wraps.
-Now not only do you have the Yeerks after you, you have every human scientist on the planet looking for you and trying to capture you.
-You wouldn't fit into a lot of places, possibly even the Yeerk pool (depending on how deep the cave is.)
-It's probably very hard to be precise with a dinosaur morph, which would lead to a total Cassie meltdown after you accidentally chomped three other people along with your target.
-With a morph that large, its going to be hard to be agile, which would mean a swarm of Hork'Bajir would probably take you down faster than something like a Tiger Morph.
-I think that Visser three would have a morph that could take out a Dinosaur...I mean, he had a freakin dragon. (The Nartec, maybe it wasn't exactly a dragon, but it breathed fire, lol.)
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Mercora genocide.
That is all.
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Huh? What do you mean?
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Huh? What do you mean?
Poparena is talking about the fact that Tobias allowed the Mercora to die (and in fact sabotaged their method of salvation) on the supposition that the asteroid that wiped them out is the one that killed the Dinosaurs, thus allowing Mammals to take control of the world, leading to Humanity.
It's a point of rage for him. If you watch his videos on YouTube, he mentions it every single time he talks about Tobias after his Megamorphs 2 review. There was literally a 10-ish minute rant about it in the Megamorphs 2 review.
Poparena, seriously. Let it go. It's boring now.
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I HAVE watched his vids on YouTube. I just have no idea how it relates to this issue.
And I agree, poparena. You may not like it, but that's your opinion, and if you keep on using it, you're going to find yourself losing reviewers really, and before anyone accuse me, it's not a threat. Just an opinion.
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I thought the thread had evolved into a general Megamorphs #2 thing since we weren't talking about evolution anymore. Sorry about that, I'll change my pet peeve to the Buffahuman like everyone else.
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Aw, am I the only person that liked and was sad for buffa-human? :( Poor guy. I think it would have been interesting if they recruited him and tried to make him know how to act human and fight the Yeerks. (Then again, that concept ties into my fanfic series in a weird way.)
I'll keep my pet peeve Cassie. Oh, and in book 18 (the decision) where Ax just assumes that Yeerks infiltrated the homeworld because the Visser morphed a Kafit bird. Um...I thought that Andalites regularly acquired and used Kafit bird morphs for fun. And I thought Alloran was an Andalite before he was an Andalite controller...mreh?
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I have so many pet peeves I can't even count them... but I do think the biggest one would be the nuclear explosion underwater that poparena pointed out.
Yes, I felt sad for the buffa-human too. It was like Godzilla; he was the result of what humans made him.