Richard's Animorphs Forum

Animorphs Section => Animorphs Forum Classic => Topic started by: estrid on June 09, 2008, 12:03:53 AM

Title: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 09, 2008, 12:03:53 AM
what i don't get is how it happened, or more like why. cuz when he got injured, why didn't he just morph into sumthing, anything, and then demorph, and he woulda been healed. instead, he wasted time looking for the time matrix. i mean, i don't buy the whole "he was too injured" thing, cuz the animorphs have been in way worse shape then a burn on their side, and managed to morph. i don't see how if elfangor is morph capable he could have been dying.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 09, 2008, 12:10:11 AM
...well I think it has something to do with the "will to keep fighting thing".  The andalites...well they aren't known for fighting till the very end. He probably thought that the burn was so severe, there was nothing he could do about it.

Or it could be he didn't have enough time to morph and demorph, although I kinda doubt that.

Yeah, lame answer, but I couldn't think of a better one.

The real answer is probably K.A. didn't think of morphing healing injuries till #4.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Duff on June 09, 2008, 12:24:44 AM
maybe elfangor didnt know about morphing injuries, AC is a little hazy, but did he do any of it before? and morphing tech was still a little unknown maybe the andalites didnt really know much about that

or, maybe he saw that his timeline ended at that point and didnt try to change destiny

or, maybe he was just like okay this is a badass way to die, i think ill go with this

but andalites are def the kind of people to go down fighting, so thats def not the reason
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: filmstu2005 on June 09, 2008, 12:38:33 AM
Um...yea. i have absolutely no idea. KASU?
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: RYTX on June 09, 2008, 12:44:35 AM
I would like to call into question the severity of his injures; it had to be more than just a burn. I mean, he couldn't be hit directly and his ship was still in good enough shape to touch down. We don't really know how bad he was hurt.
Plus morphing takes energy; after a space fight, seeing his whole fleet ( and assuming that his brother) are blasted to ash, getting banged up and crash landing on Earth; he couldn't even stand up till the last throw down.
Between that and his injuries I think he has a decent excuse to not be able to, or try, a morph
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Mongoose on June 09, 2008, 05:14:18 AM
what i don't get is how it happened, or more like why. cuz when he got injured, why didn't he just morph into sumthing, anything, and then demorph, and he woulda been healed. instead, he wasted time looking for the time matrix. i mean, i don't buy the whole "he was too injured" thing, cuz the animorphs have been in way worse shape then a burn on their side, and managed to morph. i don't see how if elfangor is morph capable he could have been dying.

Back up there for a second. He did NOT was time looking for the time matrix. In the end he's just one soldier, but the time matrix is the most powerful weapon in the universe, the side which can controls it can easily turn the tide of the war.
As to the morphing question, I don't think any of us know enough about Andalite physiology to comment on the severity of his injuries. Maybe, for whatever reason, he was unable to morph. Plus there wouldn't have been the time to do what you were suggesting. If he had morphed then demorphed then he would have been surrounded by Yeerks and Visser 3, a hopeless situation.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 09, 2008, 05:27:07 AM
yes, there are possible theories, one is the time.... it takes several minutes to morph and demorph, and by that time, the Animorphs would be pretty much scared just watching the morphing process. Also, by that time, The yeerks will find him. Well, he probably thought it would take less time to just give the power to 5 kids.

One other i can think of is that Elfangor didn't know morphing heals injuries. Morphing technology is pretty new at the time. In fact, only the Animorphs exploited this part of morphing. Andalites and (Yeerks) used the morphing power mostly for stealth and raw power only (See: Visser Three).
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 09, 2008, 05:31:19 AM
actually, it'd only take a total of about 4 minutes only. two minutes to morph, two minutes to demorph.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 09, 2008, 05:33:08 AM
Well, the time it took to talk to 5 terrified kids might take less, right? Plus, after morphing and demorphing, he have had to talk to these five kids, knowing that one of them is his son. That would take to much time. Also, he was injured, morphing takes concentration and energy, and the injury might make him morph a bit longer....
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 09, 2008, 05:38:44 AM
talking to five kids, not really. they might not believe him, like marco did, and might take longer.

No, he doesn't necessarily have to talk to his son, and besides he could just say it in thought-speech while morphing.

that last part, I'll buy.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: esplin on June 09, 2008, 06:11:09 AM
I would like to call into question the severity of his injures; it had to be more than just a burn. I mean, he couldn't be hit directly and his ship was still in good enough shape to touch down. We don't really know how bad he was hurt.
Plus morphing takes energy; after a space fight, seeing his whole fleet ( and assuming that his brother) are blasted to ash, getting banged up and crash landing on Earth; he couldn't even stand up till the last throw down.
Between that and his injuries I think he has a decent excuse to not be able to, or try, a morph

im gonna say you nailed it.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: sundi on June 09, 2008, 09:49:06 AM
Elfangor had to die, this was crucial to the plot, perhaps the ellimist had told him he was to die and that's why he didn't bother to morph
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: ~ on June 09, 2008, 09:56:52 AM
Not enough time to morph, demorph, tell the kids what they need to know, and give them the morphing cube.

Sure it's BS, but that's the explanation that always worked for me.

Edit: I just remembered something. Some other things in the first book ended up not being true (out of morph thought speak) so it's possible that the 'too weak to morph' thing was changed.

Also, has there ever even been a time where they were about to die when they were out of morph? Cause it might be that demorphing is easier then morphing.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: ThermalRider on June 09, 2008, 10:15:01 AM
Well, Elfangor probably needed to stay in his Andalite body to bring the ship down to land. By that time, he saw the kids and probably figured that this was his chance to pass on to Earth a chance for survival, he had seen what human kids were capable of beforehand.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: ~ on June 09, 2008, 10:57:05 AM
Here's a question, did he still have his human morph? Cause...

Wait, no! I'll save that idea for a fan fic! Yay!

I'll tell anyone who asks nicely.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: RYTX on June 09, 2008, 12:57:59 PM
Thank you Esplin ;D

However no I must say
Quote
One other i can think of is that Elfangor didn't know morphing heals injuries. Morphing technology is pretty new at the time. In fact, only the Animorphs exploited this part of morphing. Andalites and (Yeerks) used the morphing power mostly for stealth and raw power only (See: Visser Three).

How is the morphing technology new at that time?
Elfangor went down in the nineties; probably 95-96.
Aldrea was morphing in HBC which was the 1960's
Morphing is about as old as the moon landing; I think they'd understand it's healing effects, especially since the Animorphs realized this in a number of weeks at the most.
Just sayin
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: OrcaMorph on June 09, 2008, 01:29:48 PM
He said specifically that he was too weak to morph.  True, the Animorphs have morphed out of worse.  However, the Animorphs were WAY more practiced at morphing, which takes energy, than any millitary Andalite.  If morphing was running, the Animorphs are hard core marine sprinter/marathon runners, and most Andalites are casual joggers.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 09, 2008, 03:07:19 PM
what i don't get is how it happened, or more like why. cuz when he got injured, why didn't he just morph into sumthing, anything, and then demorph, and he woulda been healed. instead, he wasted time looking for the time matrix. i mean, i don't buy the whole "he was too injured" thing, cuz the animorphs have been in way worse shape then a burn on their side, and managed to morph. i don't see how if elfangor is morph capable he could have been dying.

Back up there for a second. He did NOT was time looking for the time matrix. In the end he's just one soldier, but the time matrix is the most powerful weapon in the universe, the side which can controls it can easily turn the tide of the war.
As to the morphing question, I don't think any of us know enough about Andalite physiology to comment on the severity of his injuries. Maybe, for whatever reason, he was unable to morph. Plus there wouldn't have been the time to do what you were suggesting. If he had morphed then demorphed then he would have been surrounded by Yeerks and Visser 3, a hopeless situation.

at the end of the AC, it says elfangor was looking for the time matrix for one last desperate hope to save himself (obvious paraphrasing here). so he coulda been morphing on the way down to earth instead.

like with mertil, they ask why he didnt just morph to save his tail, member? so it is possible to morph and demorph to heal injuries, or in 42, when rachel is burned by marco's stomach acid, she morphs grizzly, then demorphs.

  i think its a KASU, like with jake thought speaking as a human in book 1. she proly didn't think to use morphing as a way to heal one's self till later. so all ppl who said that, it makes sense
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 09, 2008, 03:39:46 PM
In the AC Elfangor sorta goes through this process of blindly following Andalite military culture to seeing the larger, grittier, cosmic scope of things, eventually becoming a sorta modernist hero(my US lit knowledge is showing), so he learns to think for himself and accept what he can't control. He also knew a little from the Ellimist what was going to happen. I think that's why he didn't morph out, he knew he was basically toast-but then he saw the kids, realized the purpose of the situation, and figured he should give them the cube.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Hylian Dan on June 09, 2008, 04:03:07 PM
The Ellimist didn't give him back his morphing powers, possibly? He had been a nothlit, after all.

Most likely, though, it's a KASU that needs some fanwanking.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: wolfev on June 09, 2008, 04:45:38 PM
remember also that Andalites rarely use morphing tech. So all the members of the military may just be oblivious to the benefits of morphing. Remember, the animorphs were really the only ones to take it to its full potential.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Mongoose on June 09, 2008, 04:50:25 PM
Ok, stupid question time, what does KASU stand for?
Estrid, fair point about the time matrix, it's been a while since I read the AC so I can;t remember exactly what was said.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Venom on June 09, 2008, 04:52:32 PM
KA Applegate Screws Up
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 09, 2008, 04:55:52 PM
Not to be confused with KAFU ::).
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 09, 2008, 05:15:51 PM
ok another stupid question: what's KAFU?
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 10, 2008, 12:30:17 AM
KAFU same as KASU, except the F is a worse wrd ::)


and the andalite scientists 40 + yrs after developing morphing tech shoulda had SOME idea of its benefits :-\
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 10, 2008, 04:46:46 AM
Okay guys, finding a realistic answer is better than just stamping it off as a KASU, right? Plus, that scene was recreated at TAC, so it couldn't possibly be a KASU. I mean, recreating the error is just wrong.

The simple answer might be that he was too weak to morph. By the way, Mertil was somehow incapable of getting the morphing power, i think.

Morphing needs energy, and Elfangor probably worn all of it. He must be pained to death by that time.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 10, 2008, 04:54:16 AM
didn't it say somewhere (I think #50) that mertil was allergic to the morphing power and couldn't receive it?
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 10, 2008, 05:02:14 AM
Yes! Now I remember the reason of him being incapable of morphing... but still, he could be of use as a pilot. Mertil, as I've read is a very skilled pilot, right? Andalites just view vecols as.... i don't know... different.

Kind of like humans treat handicaps. And humans deny the fact that we treat them differently. Ax pointed it out innocently.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 10, 2008, 06:58:59 PM
what i ment by mertil as an example was, that if he HAD been able to morph, he coulda morphed to heal his tail. the only reason he didn't was cuz he is allergic to the tech. but my point is is even with grave injuries, andalites can still morph to heal themselves, so long as they are morph capable. so why didn't elfangor? that def needed to be explained better :-\
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 11, 2008, 05:40:27 AM
Getting an Andalite tail isn't really that grave IMO. And also, as far as i know, he had the other Andalite (forgot the name) treat him here on Earth. While Elfangor got his ship shot by thousands of Dracons of the Blade Ship, THEN crash land on Earth... not to mention while burning in his already damaged to the core mini Fighter ship. THAT is fatal.

And, not really, as in some books pointed out, morphing takes powerful concentration AND the energy like you've run in a sprint. Maybe Elfangor was running out of energy needed to morph.... like when we are in loss of blood, etc, how humans get weak in those situations.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 11, 2008, 08:13:57 AM
And humans deny the fact that we treat them differently. Ax pointed it out innocently.
In America, the true vecols are the homeless, poor, those on welfare. But that's capitalism for ya >:( :(.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 12, 2008, 06:49:31 PM
Getting an Andalite tail isn't really that grave IMO. And also, as far as i know, he had the other Andalite (forgot the name) treat him here on Earth. While Elfangor got his ship shot by thousands of Dracons of the Blade Ship, THEN crash land on Earth... not to mention while burning in his already damaged to the core mini Fighter ship. THAT is fatal.

And, not really, as in some books pointed out, morphing takes powerful concentration AND the energy like you've run in a sprint. Maybe Elfangor was running out of energy needed to morph.... like when we are in loss of blood, etc, how humans get weak in those situations.

ya but if u remember, to an andalite, not having a tail is a fate worse than death, so if mertil could morph, he would have. but i dont know, i think it should have been explained at least in the AC why elfangor didn't morph.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: OrcaMorph on June 12, 2008, 07:52:21 PM
In America, the true vecols are the homeless, poor, those on welfare. But that's capitalism for ya >:( :(.

Yep.  Stupid dirty capitalism and all its atrocious freedom  >:( :(
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Venom on June 12, 2008, 07:53:50 PM
exactly, GO SOCIALISM!!!
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 12, 2008, 08:38:29 PM
In America, the true vecols are the homeless, poor, those on welfare. But that's capitalism for ya >:( :(.

Yep.  Stupid dirty capitalism and all its atrocious freedom  >:( :(
Oh yeah, what would we ever do without the 'freedom' to lie, cheat, steal, bribe, subliminally brainwash, exploit the honest, and screw over the public good for our own personal gain? Or what would we ever do without practical slavery to our creditors and the owners of the resource industries that leave us at their mercy on a whim?
Nope, we definitely can't do without that kinda freedom.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Duff on June 12, 2008, 08:53:59 PM
In America, the true vecols are the homeless, poor, those on welfare. But that's capitalism for ya >:( :(.

Yep.  Stupid dirty capitalism and all its atrocious freedom  >:( :(
Oh yeah, what would we ever do without the 'freedom' to lie, cheat, steal, bribe, subliminally brainwash, exploit the honest, and screw over the public good for our own personal gain? Or what would we ever do without practical slavery to our creditors and the owners of the resource industries that leave us at their mercy on a whim?
Nope, we definitely can't do without that kinda freedom.

communists! quick get the commie cannon!
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 12, 2008, 09:01:51 PM
I'm a social democrat, thankyouverymuch. NOT a communist!
And an anticapitalist, of course. ;)
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: AniDragon on June 12, 2008, 09:03:02 PM
Maybe Andalites have less stamina? So something the Animorphs could have morphed out of, even exhausted, would be a lot harder for Andalites...

Or something.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 12, 2008, 11:02:00 PM
but arent andalites supposed to have more stamina since they have that extra heart, so it can pump oxygen thru their system more efficiently?
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 13, 2008, 04:12:20 AM
what about ax, he's been through the same battles.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 13, 2008, 08:34:53 AM
Well, he probably can't morph AND give morphing power to the 5 kids. Maybe he had only to choose one or the other. Since morphing would scare the Animorphs.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Chad32 on June 13, 2008, 10:45:06 PM
It's been stated that even though most Andalites possess morphing ability, only spies use it. Elfangor left Earth and became a pilot, so he probably didn't have a habit of morphing injuries away. So the thought of morphing something to heal himself didn't cross his mind after he landed and saw the group.

Or maybe he figured it best to give the group morphing powers on the spot instead of healing himself and being on the run from the army of Yeerks that were about two minutes behind him.

Those are my two ideas.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 13, 2008, 11:44:41 PM
but y didnt he just morph on the way down to earth? cuz then by the time he landed he would be andalite again. AND he would be a healthy andalite again.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 14, 2008, 06:34:53 AM
It's been stated that even though most Andalites possess morphing ability, only spies use it. Elfangor left Earth and became a pilot, so he probably didn't have a habit of morphing injuries away. So the thought of morphing something to heal himself didn't cross his mind after he landed and saw the group.

Or maybe he figured it best to give the group morphing powers on the spot instead of healing himself and being on the run from the army of Yeerks that were about two minutes behind him.

Those are my two ideas.

I buy Daphnes's ideas. Yes, if Elfangor survived, the Yeerks would be in alarm finding "the Elfangor". which would quickly endanger the identity of the Animorphs and make them lose earlier in the series. And probably, Elfangor didn't use morphing much, so the healing fact didn't cross his mind.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: OrcaMorph on June 16, 2008, 12:22:12 AM
It crossed his mind.  He specifically said "to weak to morph."  Yes, the Animorphs have morphed out of worse, but the Animorphs have had WAY more practice doing so.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 16, 2008, 12:53:05 AM
ya but to me, that's a lame explantion. "too weak to morph", what the hell is the that? in AC he shoulda explained his injuries a bit better so itd make sense
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 16, 2008, 01:54:48 PM
I imagine when one is a hurtling towards a planet, trying not to crash land in a burning wreckage is top priority in the mind ::).
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 16, 2008, 07:07:31 PM
I imagine when one is a hurtling towards a planet, trying not to crash land in a burning wreckage is top priority in the mind ::).


yes, but then how come searching 4 the time matrix was? thats how he came to be in the site in the 1rst place
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Toby on June 16, 2008, 07:30:31 PM
hmm. good question.   

They say that morphing takes some of your energy and i think that even the animorphs mentioned they feel very weak when they have to morph and demorph continuiosly. So yeah, I guess he was just too exhasted to even try. Shooting down Yeerk bug fighters must have tired him out, lol.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: zaprowsdower on June 16, 2008, 09:24:24 PM
yes, but then how come searching 4 the time matrix was? thats how he came to be in the site in the 1rst place
That's what he was doing when he got shot down.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: TheSoulEater on June 16, 2008, 10:30:14 PM
The Time Matrix was his only hope at that point. With the Andalites above Earth virtually destroyed and himself critically wounded, the Matrix was his last recourse. Of course it'd be a priority.

It's not like morphing would have helped, anyway. Even if he had the energy, Visser Three got there only minutes later. He would have noticed a fully-healed Andalite walking around or a kafit bird flying away. Elfangor was doomed either way; his only chance was to undo it all.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on June 17, 2008, 12:45:43 AM
he was
yes, but then how come searching 4 the time matrix was? thats how he came to be in the site in the 1rst place
That's what he was doing when he got shot down.

but he was already injured when he was lookin 4 the time matrix.

and i'm not really arguing that elfangor needed to die. what i'm saying is is that the way he died is kinda lame when u take the whole morphing thing in2 consideration
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 17, 2008, 05:46:09 AM
Quote
The Time Matrix was his only hope at that point. With the Andalites above Earth virtually destroyed and himself critically wounded, the Matrix was his last recourse. Of course it'd be a priority.

It's not like morphing would have helped, anyway. Even if he had the energy, Visser Three got there only minutes later. He would have noticed a fully-healed Andalite walking around or a kafit bird flying away. Elfangor was doomed either way; his only chance was to undo it all.

Even if Elfangor morphed.... the Yeerks would have come to him by then. So... either try to haul butt and morph out THEN die... why not just accept the fact... and instead, give hope by giving the mighty morphing power to the Animorphs.

Andalites never used the morphing power much. You can't compare them to the Animorphs. After all, they aren't called "Animorphs" for nothing. They are more experienced in morphing than anyone.. even any Andalite... since they use (and abuse) it the most. The Animorphs morph out of fatal injuries because they had a lot of practice, while Elfangor morphed... what? 5 times?

Its just like typing, for example. I can type a faster even without looking at the keyboard than others who need to look while they type. Its just like that.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on June 17, 2008, 05:57:33 AM
wait...do the books actually say someone in morph touching the cube can't give the morphing power? I don't think the books ever say you need to be in your normal form to give morphing power (although most likely you do need to be in your original form). Sure, in every situation, the person with the power to morph was in their original form, but they didn't have a reason to be in morph (except for maybe this situation, but that's not the point). Just something I thought of.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: CounterInstinct on June 17, 2008, 07:03:17 AM
the holy scriptures never pointed out that you have to be in your original form.... but, unfortunately, the holy scriptures also never pointed out that you can give it in morph.  :P

It's actually pretty vague...  :)
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Gafrash on October 11, 2008, 08:17:26 AM
what i don't get is how it happened, or more like why. cuz when he got injured, why didn't he just morph into sumthing, anything, and then demorph, and he woulda been healed. instead, he wasted time looking for the time matrix. i mean, i don't buy the whole "he was too injured" thing, cuz the animorphs have been in way worse shape then a burn on their side, and managed to morph. i don't see how if elfangor is morph capable he could have been dying.

Back up there for a second. He did NOT was time looking for the time matrix. In the end he's just one soldier, but the time matrix is the most powerful weapon in the universe, the side which can controls it can easily turn the tide of the war.
As to the morphing question, I don't think any of us know enough about Andalite physiology to comment on the severity of his injuries. Maybe, for whatever reason, he was unable to morph. Plus there wouldn't have been the time to do what you were suggesting. If he had morphed then demorphed then he would have been surrounded by Yeerks and Visser 3, a hopeless situation.

at the end of the AC, it says elfangor was looking for the time matrix for one last desperate hope to save himself (obvious paraphrasing here). so he coulda been morphing on the way down to earth instead.

like with mertil, they ask why he didnt just morph to save his tail, member? so it is possible to morph and demorph to heal injuries, or in 42, when rachel is burned by marco's stomach acid, she morphs grizzly, then demorphs.

  i think its a KASU, like with jake thought speaking as a human in book 1. she proly didn't think to use morphing as a way to heal one's self till later. so all ppl who said that, it makes sense



I would like to call into question the severity of his injures; it had to be more than just a burn. I mean, he couldn't be hit directly and his ship was still in good enough shape to touch down. We don't really know how bad he was hurt.
Plus morphing takes energy; after a space fight, seeing his whole fleet ( and assuming that his brother) are blasted to ash, getting banged up and crash landing on Earth; he couldn't even stand up till the last throw down.
Between that and his injuries I think he has a decent excuse to not be able to, or try, a morph

I am going to dare say it's most definitely a K.A.S.U.!
I fail to imagine an injury which would stop concentration for an Andalite to morph. Given the range of morphs our Animorphs heroes demorphed away from, even from the brink of death. Heck, I even recall them demorphing whilst passing out/losing consciousness. They regain from a morph totally 100% human.
Why would this experienced Andalite Prince be any different?! I am sorry, but fatigue doesn't seem to cut it either. Or could the kids be a more strong-minded lot not letting fear, pain, near-death encounters, fatigue get the best out of them?! Elfangor had last remaining strength enough to strike at Visser 3's Antarean Bogg morph before the end.
So nope, sorry, it's a K.A.S.U. for me.

The truth is, there had to be an impact on the new reader, as to how this noble and iconic alien hero had already decided to sacrifice himself for the human race. A lethal unrepairable injury was the plot device.

Could the answer perhaps lie in the possibility of Elfangor NOT HAVING THE MORPHING POWER AT THAT MOMENT?!
This is just a theory of mine, but I am thinking MAYBE, after the Andalite Chronicles, the Ellimist and Elfangor with the Time Mattix and all re-winded everything to a point past to the moment he was first given his power to morph and never ended up getting it somehow. We all know doing something different in the past changes somethings that would happen normally in the future.
So maybe Elfangor rejected the technology?!?!?!?
Of course, this would contradict everything as to why he would have carried an Escafil Device in his spacecraft and why he would break Seerow's Kindness to use it on the Earth kids.
Sooo much for me theory...
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on October 11, 2008, 02:31:28 PM
finally gafrash, sum1 who agrees with me. but ur theory may wrk if u apply it to after elfangor was made an andalite again after having become a human nothlit. it coulda been that he was stuck as an andalite nothlit type thing, where he is no longer able to morph. but see, all of this coulda easily been explained in the AC, but they werent :-\
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: wolfev on October 11, 2008, 05:07:33 PM
Actually the nothlit ideas makes sense. I mean the Andalites don't usually morph. Plus he was made into a Prince right after he got back to the fleet so there is a good chance he would not to have had to morph from then on. No one would have noticed because he wouldn't be morphing anyway. We can also say that maybe he still had his morphing power but like Tobias after he was given the power back, lost all his previous morphs. To try and reaquire the one morph he had, The Kafit bird, would seem somewhat odd for a prince to do. There would be a whole enquirery since not many people knew about the Ellimists intervention.This would cause him to tell the whole story of what had happened. I think Elfangor would have rather just keep the story secret.
Title: Question about the first book: Why did Elfangor not morph?
Post by: Toc' on December 28, 2008, 04:55:01 AM
WHY didn't he morph and then go away with Rachel, tobias, Jake,... and the blue cube before the yeerks landed ?
He was seriously injuried but it would have make him good again...

No really, i still don't understand.
Title: Re: Question about the first book: Why did Elfangor not morph?
Post by: morfowt on December 28, 2008, 05:58:06 AM
http://animorphsforum.com/forum/index.php/topic,227.0.html
Title: Re: Question about the first book: Why did Elfangor not morph?
Post by: Toc' on December 28, 2008, 06:07:41 AM
Thanks^^
I thought someone could have already asked the question but honestly i was too lazy to check too far  :-[
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Dameg on December 28, 2008, 07:26:58 AM
Sorry, I didn't read everything, so I don't know if somebody said that but here 2 ideas :
- Elfangor thought morphing and demorphing must be too long and the Yeerks would arrive and torture him (or maybe make him a Controller, but I think more about a long, very very long torture by Esplin); morphing only and leave with the Animorphs make them in danger because he mustn't have so many morph, maybe only kafit or that kind of things, and Yeerk could find him out easily, and maybe find the Animorphs too...
well, not very good explanation but... this one is better:
- When the Ellimist give him back his body, he didn't give him back the morphing power nor the capacity to acquire it again, so he couldn't morph any more! even if he has the morphing cube, he couldn't use it...
this last repear the KASU ;) don't you think?
Title: Re: Question about the first book: Why did Elfangor not morph?
Post by: Chad32 on December 28, 2008, 09:54:41 AM
In AC he says he was tired, or something along those lines. Tired of the war, and tired of the fighting. He was ready to die. That's all we get.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on December 28, 2008, 05:21:38 PM
WHY didn't he morph and then go away with Rachel, tobias, Jake,... and the blue cube before the yeerks landed ?
He was seriously injuried but it would have make him good again...

No really, i still don't understand.


and u are echoing the point of this thread :P

ya that i feel was very poorly incorporated into the story line :-X
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: dolphin4077 on December 28, 2008, 06:32:13 PM
1. Did Elfangor have any morph more useful for combat than his own Andalite body?  Can't know for certain, but I assume no.
2. Even if he had morphed then demorphed for healing purposes, could he still take on Visser 3 and all those Controllers and survive?  I don't think so.
3.  If he had morphed something to escape, he would have condemmed the Animorphs to death or becoming controllers.  If the Yeerks had come across a deserted Andalite fighter, they would have spent a lot more energy searching the contruction site and most likely would have found the Animorphs. 
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Toc' on December 29, 2008, 02:05:43 AM
WHY didn't he morph and then go away with Rachel, tobias, Jake,... and the blue cube before the yeerks landed ?
He was seriously injuried but it would have make him good again...

No really, i still don't understand.


and u are echoing the point of this thread :P

ya that i feel was very poorly incorporated into the story line :-X



I actually created a whole thread about it, but i didn't know there was already one ^^


Quote
3.  If he had morphed something to escape, he would have condemmed the Animorphs to death or becoming controllers.  If the Yeerks had come across a deserted Andalite fighter, they would have spent a lot more energy searching the contruction site and most likely would have found the Animorphs. 

But he lost so much time explaining stuff etc...
They could have ran away before the Yeerks found them.
He would have morphed in Kafit and then, once sheltered from the Yeerks, demorphed and explained everything.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on December 29, 2008, 02:08:39 AM
yes! had he healed himself thru morphing and escaped with the others, there woulda been time later to explain. and im sure he coulda given a better explanation too had he had more time
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Toc' on December 29, 2008, 02:11:12 AM
yes! had he healed himself thru morphing and escaped with the others, there woulda been time later to explain. and im sure he coulda given a better explanation too had he had more time

He could also have found the "globe spacio-temporel" (I can't find the English word) since it was its goal !
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: morfowt on December 29, 2008, 05:20:38 AM
hmm...from english words that are similiar to those, I'm gonna guess you mean time matrix...
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Dameg on December 29, 2008, 06:53:01 AM
Yes, it's what she means ^^
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: V2113 on December 31, 2008, 12:46:02 AM
If he morphed I think only Tobias would've stayed. The others would've run screaming.

I think he wanted to die. He thought his brother was dead, the Yeerks were here, he had passed on the morphing technology to another species and broken the law of Seerow's Kindness. Not to mention the fact that Tobias told him Loren had disappeared from Tobias's sight. And that he thought his father died. He didn't want to live. And, as it is made clear in a certain book, not sure which, morphing can go wonky if your emotions are on the fritz, and trust me they must've been for Elfangor.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Toc' on December 31, 2008, 01:23:13 AM
Yeah, he was sick of fighting, he felt it was high time he died.
That's the only really good explaination to me...

Cause if he wanted to live and keep fighting he could have found many ways to escape before the yeerks landed.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Taiyoh on December 31, 2008, 02:04:58 AM
If he morphed I think only Tobias would've stayed. The others would've run screaming.

I think he wanted to die. He thought his brother was dead, the Yeerks were here, he had passed on the morphing technology to another species and broken the law of Seerow's Kindness. Not to mention the fact that Tobias told him Loren had disappeared from Tobias's sight. And that he thought his father died. He didn't want to live. And, as it is made clear in a certain book, not sure which, morphing can go wonky if your emotions are on the fritz, and trust me they must've been for Elfangor.

I agree with this.  Personally, I'd be a little depressed if that had happened to me.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Dameg on December 31, 2008, 02:18:27 AM
True. How not to be depressed!? But he could stay for his son...
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: V2113 on December 31, 2008, 03:31:53 AM
His son that thinks he's dead and who only after everything he'd been through could believe he was his son.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Dameg on December 31, 2008, 03:54:23 AM
lol true but... I think Tobias would be happy to have a father... alive.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Toc' on December 31, 2008, 03:56:25 AM
lol true but... I think Tobias would be happy to have a father... alive.
And Loren ?
I'm so sad when I think of her  :(
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Dameg on December 31, 2008, 04:07:40 AM
Yeah... he could stay for her too ^^'
But a so happy end... no way! lol
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on December 31, 2008, 04:29:34 PM
i think elfangor wanting to die is just a weak excuse. i mean sure that does come off as the reason, cuz there really is no other logical explanation, but i dk, knowing tobias his son is there should be an incentive to stay alive, even if just for a little while, so that he could meet his son.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: Horsefan1023 (Seal) on January 01, 2009, 08:29:11 PM
I don't think he wanted to die either.  I think that he realized that he couldn't hide his ship, so the Visser would find him anyway.  The Visser would realize that he had morphed and find him and kill him anyway.  Elfangor probably thought he was gonna die anyway, so he wanted to give humans a chance to fight.
Title: Re: Elfangor's death
Post by: estrid on January 01, 2009, 10:23:11 PM
i dk, that still doesnt seem like a good reason. so what if he was gona die anyways, he shoulda survived to live to fight another day, insteada just givin up and then dying there