Richard's Animorphs Forum

Animorphs Section => Animorphs Forum Classic => Topic started by: wotw2112 on August 11, 2008, 04:15:15 PM

Title: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wotw2112 on August 11, 2008, 04:15:15 PM
Maybe this idea has been brought up before but:

The premise of morphing is the absorbing of DNA.  So...

1. Could someone acquire DNA from a dead body?  The DNA is still there.

2. Could someone possibly acquire the dna of something extinct (i.e. they've found Dinosaur DNA in bones, etc)  It would seem if they could somehow make it in a large enough quantity to touch then it should be absorbable.

Unless I'm missing some fundamental rule about the creature having to be alive (which I don't recall).
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 11, 2008, 04:20:14 PM
We don't know why, but it is said to be impossible to acquire anything that's dead, which would obviously include fossils of extinct creatures.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: AniDragon on August 11, 2008, 04:37:26 PM
It says at one point in the book that the creature being acquired needs to be alive. However, seeing as how Ax said you could acquire from blood alone in book 18, I'm going to guess that it might be more along the lines of the blood needing to still be warm. So recently dead bodies might be acquirable.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 11, 2008, 04:56:26 PM
Presumably there is something about the morphing technology that requires living tissue in order to allow the acquiring process. Since the thing about acquiring from blood alone was only mentioned in #18 then it's possible that KA simply made that part up just as a plot device for that book.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wotw2112 on August 12, 2008, 03:32:37 PM
Ok, i guess that makes sense but DNA is DNA...stupid frustrating limitations of made-up technology  ;D
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 12, 2008, 03:37:05 PM
Well for fossils it probably makes sense, since after millions of years I doubt there is a lot of DNA left. That's why they had to use blood taken from mosquitoes in Jurassic Park, there wasn't enough DNA left in the actual fossils to clone the Dinosaurs.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wolfev on August 12, 2008, 03:42:56 PM
I think the idea is that they need a living cell. Blood could possibly contain cells that are still alive. Here is a better question. Can you aquire and morph a creature that lacks a central nervous system?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wotw2112 on August 12, 2008, 03:43:10 PM
Well for fossils it probably makes sense, since after millions of years I doubt there is a lot of DNA left. That's why they had to use blood taken from mosquitoes in Jurassic Park, there wasn't enough DNA left in the actual fossils to clone the Dinosaurs.

I thought the same and any blood taken from fossilized amber probably would be too little to allow for acquiring anyway...but if they could find a way to synthetically reproduce it?

Can you aquire and morph a creature that lacks a central nervous system?

I would have to say yes.  DNA is DNA.  Is there some other factor I'm not considering?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Estelore on August 12, 2008, 03:52:44 PM
*nods*

If it has no C.Nervous system...it has no BRAIN.
How do you control it?
In view: jellyfish?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wotw2112 on August 12, 2008, 03:59:39 PM
*nods*

If it has no C.Nervous system...it has no BRAIN.
How do you control it?
In view: jellyfish?

Yeah but so what?  A cat doesn't have a human brain but the morpher maintains their human personality and thoughts in morph anyway so I can't imagine the lack of a brain would matter.  They just wouldn't have to fight for control as there would really be nothing opposing them.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Estelore on August 12, 2008, 04:04:11 PM
Hmmmn...how to explain. Aha!

Okay, you know that humans NEVER use 100% of their brain at once? Seriously. Using more than 60% of your brain (JUST the 'thinking' part, not counting the sensory areas and the centres of balance and symbol/word recognition) at a time is what doctors call "epileptic seizure".

I think that when they morph an animal, they use the parts of the brain that aren't occupied at the time. NOTHING uses all its brain at once. EVER.

So...what do you do when there is no brain to use?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wolfev on August 12, 2008, 04:12:01 PM
No I mean since this is alien technology it should not be specific to animals since animals are just a kingdom classified by humans. Since DNA is DNA that means the animorphs should be able to morph bacteria or plants. However, they could not exert control over something without a central nervous system. Oh jellyfish would be possible because though they lack a brain they do have a nervous simple.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Estelore on August 12, 2008, 04:17:31 PM
Obviously, the only purpose for morphing a plant in the first place would be to hide or to obtain some medicinal/toxic/caustic chemical from the plant, but both cases are redundant:

Hide? The Yeerks burn EVERYTHING.

Chemical? Just get it from the original plant, instead of acquiring it.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 12, 2008, 04:19:10 PM
Unless I'm much mistaken, Starfish have no brains. However, Rachel still morphed one. Perhaps the mind of the morpher is stored in Z-space and connected to the body via the morphing technology?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: wolfev on August 12, 2008, 04:47:56 PM
yes but they have a nervous system. There is a network that is able to cause dynamic coordinated movement.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: musicman88 on August 13, 2008, 09:21:16 AM
I always wondered why they never accidentally acquired bacteria or something else that was on their hands at the time...
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 13, 2008, 09:36:31 AM
well they weren't thinking about acquiring bacteria. remember you have to sort of visualize the animal to acquire it.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 13, 2008, 09:38:57 AM
Yeah, otherwise I'd accidentally acquire every animal or human they touched.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Duff on August 13, 2008, 11:43:37 AM
Unless I'm much mistaken, Starfish have no brains. However, Rachel still morphed one. Perhaps the mind of the morpher is stored in Z-space and connected to the body via the morphing technology?

bingo, they say this in the book where ax explains the bag of matter being pushed into zspace and all that fun stuff, im pretty sure it was 18
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Yorick Brown on August 13, 2008, 12:42:16 PM
Bacteria are not animals. They're Monerans. Two completely different kingdoms.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 13, 2008, 06:12:14 PM
Bacteria are not animals. They're Monerans. Two completely different kingdoms.

do they have DNA?
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Estelore on August 13, 2008, 06:35:45 PM
They have something very similar to DNA, but more primitive.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 13, 2008, 06:43:14 PM
well then, it still fits what we're talking about

No I mean since this is alien technology it should not be specific to animals since animals are just a kingdom classified by humans. Since DNA is DNA that means the animorphs should be able to morph bacteria or plants. However, they could not exert control over something without a central nervous system. Oh jellyfish would be possible because though they lack a brain they do have a nervous simple.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Yorick Brown on August 13, 2008, 07:21:44 PM
Of course Bacteria have DNA. But tehy're still not Animals so the Animorphs can't morph them.

The definition of an aninal is specific and universal: A multicellular organism that gets it's energy from other organisms.

Elfangor, the friggin's ALIEN that gave them their powers, SAID animals.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 13, 2008, 07:22:49 PM
well tell that to wolfev then.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Gafrash on August 14, 2008, 08:37:27 AM
Yeah, The Decision has complicated the issues with the acquiring ability. But that book itself confirmed the Andalites realized that the Anirmophs themselves had more morphs than their own Andalite spies. So the Animorphs are really the ones pushing the boundaries of this piece of techonolgy.

Has anyone ever done a count on which animals were unaffected by the 'drowsy' effect that comes with the acquiring process?

Oh! And here's another question.
I always wondered, say in the case of Cassie, if she wanted to morph back to a catterpillar, would she be unable to due to the metamorphosis into her butterfly morph... Has the metamorphed DNA remain in the system, too?? And if so, would the new morph be preserved?


Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 14, 2008, 08:40:21 AM
Has anyone ever done a count on which animals were unaffected by the 'drowsy' effect that comes with the acquiring process?
I remember 2. Tobias's dolphin, and David's cobra
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Phoenix004 on August 14, 2008, 08:53:12 AM
It's weird that the Dolphin Tobias acquired didn't go into a trance, as the other Dolphins did when the other Animorphs acquired them. I'm guessing it was just a fluke, like the sedative effect has a very small chance of failing.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: morfowt on August 14, 2008, 09:00:35 AM
maybe tobias acquired a different dolphin from the others. and that particular dolphin had something special about it that made it immune...
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Raskipper on August 15, 2008, 03:10:02 PM
After reading #18, I think that the big deal isn't tissue or having a brain.  I think that it has to do with the actual flow of blood.  Example:  You wouldn't be able to acquire a bug by squishing it and trying to acquire it's blood and guts, but as a mosquito you could 'acquire' flowing, fresh oxygen-rich blood and TA-DA!!!

But who knows 100%?  Nobody.  Interesting discussion, though.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Yorick Brown on August 15, 2008, 03:28:15 PM
Maybe the mosquito blood trick was never gonna work?

Maybe you still can only acquire living animals and Jake and co. couldn't have morphed Andershot at all? Ax couldn't correct them because he's no scientist and never paid attention in class to know better.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Tim Bruening on July 01, 2015, 05:55:55 AM
well they weren't thinking about acquiring bacteria. remember you have to sort of visualize the animal to acquire it.

The Hidden: How did that buffalo acquire Chapman and Visser 3?  What would have led it to even visualize those two people?

How did the ant acquire Cassie?  (How would an ant visualize Cassie?).
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Tim Bruening on July 01, 2015, 06:02:57 AM
Of course Bacteria have DNA. But tehy're still not Animals so the Animorphs can't morph them.

The definition of an aninal is specific and universal: A multicellular organism that gets it's energy from other organisms.

Elfangor, the friggin's ALIEN that gave them their powers, SAID animals.

It could be that the Andalites have a blind spot in that area, that being their assumption that no one would want to acquire anything that can't move, so would only acquire animals.
Title: Re: Questions about acquiring...
Post by: Dylan on July 07, 2015, 01:37:13 AM
The Hidden: How did that buffalo acquire Chapman and Visser 3?  What would have led it to even visualize those two people?

How did the ant acquire Cassie?  (How would an ant visualize Cassie?).
The world may never know. It's the magic of Cassie.